[Julian Klepacki]

looks that way? I pulled the trigger on the pair of 115U’s and a set of six 051U’s. A pair for the rear-arms and the rest in waiting for the front. I’ll collect 32207’s for the races as and when, same with the 32206’s as those are readily available.

It got me thinking about the front hubs, seeing those 620048 bearings.
Buying exchange hubs from C.C will cost comparable, possibly less than buying the parts; brgs + b.joints, any tooling that maybe required and DIY. Especially factoring in the hassle of doing it, cleaning everything up, coating etc etc? I’m assuming here that C.C. put OEM-quality if not OEM bearings in the front hubs?

w.r.t grease. EP2 Complex is what is required, yeah?
On the rear-arm/stub-axle is there any merit in packing the whole ‘void’ with grease? What i mean here is apart from packing bearings appropriately. Pack the area between the two bearings on the axle & arm? There’s bit of a void there for valuable grease to track into?

Plus, on assembly of everything how is the diy enthusiast setting up end-play of those arms and stub-axle? Is it done by ‘feel’ when effectively no end-play is felt, get the dial indicator out and pick-up off a reference or is special tooling necessary?

[Julian Klepacki]

John, thanks, i see it now.

Paul, so I can use the outer-race from a 32207 with a 51U to effectively make a 51U + 52U set?
You can get a SKF 32207 for 20 quid. It works out comparable to buying races from nosparts, but his ‘unbranded’ races might be questionable quality?

My understanding of the 49U bearing as used on the front arm lower-inner, is that a SKF 32206 can be used. It’s just 0.25mm narrower than OEM 49U. I take it that is what all the parts suppliers are selling, when they say it is very close to original. The 32206 is also used on the rear-arm as talked about before, as an alternative to the 53U bearing.

Mmm, I can see myself spending a lot of money on these flipppin’ bearings, just to hold stock for future works

[Julian Klepacki]

Interesting.
nos_usparts has a lot of 51U’s too, at varying prices, not much money. Also 51U + outer-race for roughly double, but non-oem outer-race. Front arms use the race, yeah?

I also see the front wheel bearings 620048, two are used on each hub, yeah? The parts catalogue I have doesn’t show front hub bearings on hub-dwg? so thats like 300 a side? ouch!

I don’t see any 115U bearings on his listing? Maybe unavailable now?

But with the abundance of 51U’s i’m tempted to now get a set for the arms seeing as the smaller 32206 is easily available new?

[Julian Klepacki]

For clarity, more from my own understanding. The rear-arm smaller outer bearing -53U citroen number as fitted to my car is a SKF 32206, it utilises the inner-race, as it fits on the parallel shaft of the arm. The outer race is superfluous, as the taper for the rollers is part of the machined arm. Are you saying that this bearing is not the ‘exact’ replacement, but a compatible equivelant? Should it be a 32207?

The larger outer 14-roller caged bearing -51U citroen number, utilises no ‘races’ as the tapers are provided on the arm-shaft and the outer ‘sleeve’ as i’ll call it. This is the hens-teeth bearing that i’ll accept has no accesible equivelant?

Anyway, this morning I dismantled the seized adjusters from the backing-plate. I ground off the peened end and drove out the bolt. It took some hammering, proper seized. I’m thinking I could modify them to replicate the replacement adjusters avialable? If one side of the bobbin is machined off, effectively making a top-hat affair, then it could be reassembled, minus one of the concave washers, but fit a suitable spring sandwiched between the remaining end-face of the bobbin and the inner-face of the backing plate. Clamp it up an drode-weld the adjuster back on to the bolt. I have some die-springs that might be suitable is a coil or so is cut off?

ID of the bobbin is a smidge over 9mm, i measure abouyt 9.3mm. a sutable bolt could be easily made to fit. File, grind, machine the flat edges for the adjuster? Experimentation is in order.

Today, i sepnt the day working on the rear: Rain-gutters, rear-qtr-section, parcel shelf. They’ve had repairs before, some in my ownership, but not by me. In time I’ll repair this lot properly with replacemt sections. But I don’t want to go down that road now. For now i’ll carry out ‘interim’ repairs only to the sections that need them. More out of cosmetics than anyhting. Numerous repairs, over repairs had become unsightly.

worst is the NS qtr-panel. Rotten at the lower, built up with filla. I know the repair panel is available. but for simplicity i’ll fabricate it. Easy enough and it’s all covered.

NS parcel-shelf and rain gutter. It had a heavy plate welded into the gutter with the holes for that little bracket. I’ll tidy it up, so it’s not a layer of plates at least.

It’s kinda the same deal with the OS parcel-shelf/gutter.

The funky ending on the NS is good.

But the OS has been repaired and ‘boxed’ off. It looks to be all metal. Again, I know the repair section is available, but for ease i’ll fabricate it, so at least it looks the same as the NS.

If tomorrows a good weather day, I should get it all welded up?

Question: How do you remove the chrome trim across the roof above the rear window?
It looks to ‘pry’ off, but attemps looked to require flexing/stressing the trim more than i was prepared to do? There seems to be some little clips looking underneath as you get the the centre, but i have no idea how to deal with this?

TIA.

[Julian Klepacki]

I also just worked the hex back and forth until it was ‘moveable’. But as you imply it’s still really quite tight. The seized one i’ll attempt my nut-over-bolt fix. even if i managed to free it with molegrips or welding some bar on the back of the hex. I’ll still have to address those rounded off corners? I have a lathe, so can bore/drill out an appropriately sized nut to slip over the adjuster-hex?

I missed those adjuster repair kits on C.C. website, they do look a convenient solution? Especially if the spring means they don’t rely on as much friction as the original setup and less likely ot seize?

Regarding bearings: With the smaller inner-arm-bearing, i say 32206 (SKF RF 32206), as that is what is fitted to the car? I can’t be sure, but by the way things looked, i’d put money on the rear arms never being apart since fatory build?

Surely, Citroen would not have had bearings specifically made for the car? Just utilise an off-shelf bearing from whoever and make their parts fit the bearing and applying their own part number. I took it that the 53U is just citroens number for effectively a ‘32206’ bearing or one dimensionally the same?

I also concluded it’s the same with the larger outer-arm 14-roller bearing. It’s just supplied without the races, and therefore the part-number isn’t visible/obtainable. Possibly it could be reverse-engineered taking roller dimenstions, cage dimensions etc by some bearing nerd?
That is what i was hoping my local bearing specialist could do. But they are not nerdy enough.

To me, It’s just a metric, taperred roller bearing? They will be sitting on a shelfs somewhere with a std part number that has an identical cage-roller setup or dimensionally compatible. I’m sure of it? You’d have to cut the internal race out to obtain the caged-rollers alone. But it must be achievable?

During researching rear cylinders i came across a post that stated you could replace cylinder seals without actually having to remove the end-cap, so i could have saved myself the bother? ANyway, it’s done now.

As with all remanufactured parts, quality is hit/miss. I’ll contemplate purchasing a replacement rear, if only to attempt to use the internal-ram in my original cylinder. I guess NOS ones come up now and then?

I used to look at Citroen Andre for NOS parts, but their website seems a mess now? Parts shop seems to divert you to some domain/links page and another takes you to a facebook page?

With respect to paint/colour of rear gubbins. Were the rear arms ‘green’? I have evidence of green paint on mine? Seeing as i need/want to paint them anyway, i thought why not back to green. might be a nice contrast against all that black shutz?

[Julian Klepacki]

Bit more work done.
I’ve managed to undo the caps from the cylinders so i can replace seals.
First i tried a chain-clamp to undo them. No chance.

In order to undo them i had to tack-weld a block of steel across the side of the cap. This gave me something to hit against. Clamped the cylinder in a vice. A small ally block against the flat-edge and a soft-jaw against the opposite radius, mostly kept the cylinder from rotaing in the vice. Small hammer against the welded steel block as a drift and a big hammer to jolt it loose. Afterwards, cut through the tack welds and cleaned up the caps with a flapwheel.

caps have some pitting on the sides, better after a flapwheel-dressing, unsure if you can get replacements caps alone?

one of the cylinder-rams is somewhat blemished. Looks pitted, but feels smooth.
if the ram is completely retracted inside the cylinder, the blemishes do go against the seals.
But when cylinder is fitted, I don’t think the ram ever bottoms-out, so possibly the blemished are always outboard of the seals?
I was thinking if the blemishes were never against the seals, i might get away with leaving it? Can you buy the internal-ram on it’s own?

i did appear to have a leaking cylinder on the NS, but unsure if it actually was this one? Cylilnders look to be able to fit either side, but looking at casting-markings on the cylinders, they are a mirror-image, so look to be ‘sided’. I’d have to try and track-back, work out which came from the NS.

Now regarding the bearings. I went to my local bearing specialist with the 14-roller, outer arm-bearing in the off chance they could identify an equivelant. No joy. The smaller inner arm-bearing; SKF 32206 is readily available, it’s a 15-20 quid bearing.

I have pretty much concluded to re-use the fitted arm-bearings. The rollers have no corrosion, pitting and look as new. Plus they don’t really do that much ‘rotational’ work, only moving a small arc. Not like the wheel bearings. The ‘machined’ bearing surfaces are also free from any signs of corrosion/pitting.

For wheel bearings, i will replace, races have minor pitting anyway.
I’ll just get the set C.C. sell.

I did manage to remove the outer-race from the trailing-arm. I took some of that square-bar used on the cylinder-caps and ground the tip to a shape giving best purchase against the available lip on the race. I heated up the arm externally around the race area in attempt to expand it a little, no idea how effective this was? Then slowly, but firmly hammering the race out. Working in a cirulcar motion. They came out fairly easily really.

I managed to free off the adjusters on one of the backing plates. But the others are stuck fast and the hex’s damaged to the point of no more purchase.

I’m thinking to repair, if i get a large half-nut, whose ID will fit over the existing 14mm hex and weld it on. It’ll give a much larger hex, which will likely make rotation easier?

Alternatively, I see that on the actual adjuster side, it’s like riveted-over. I’m thinking this can be ground off, dismantle, freed off and reassemble with a rose-weld to hold it back on? Still have to address those damaged hex’s though.

What are folks doing to rectify seized adjusters?

So thats pretty much it for the rear, all disassembled, mostly cleaned up, ready to start assembly with new parts as required.

What are people using to repaint the arms, backing plates etc. I’m thinking going back to green, not so bothered about exact shade, just green enough. Hammerite isn’t what it used to be. POR15 seems to be the ‘go to’ for chassis/running gear nowadays?

[Julian Klepacki]

Sassens have items 4408 & 4409 that it implies are for stub-axl, as they state ‘wheel’ bearing?
You mention 4408 is possibly replacement for 53-U, which is an inner-arm bearing. Confused.com?

For my own clarity i understand the following:

Arm Inner – ZC 9620 053 U – Sassens ?
Arm Outer – ZC 9620 051 U – Sassens 4779 – CitoServ D10 3432 NOS

Stub Axle Inner – ZC 9620 070 U – 25x62x17 – Sassens 4409?
Stub Axle Outer – ZC 9620 079 U – 40x40x18 – Sassens 4408?

Anyway, I’m all bearing’d out for now. i’ll do some reserach, see what is out there.
NS arm assembly and cylinder is all out now and on the bench for stripping.
Visitors due, so I have my orders to get cleaned up and made presentable.

[Julian Klepacki]

Thanks for all the responses.
I don’t have new bearings, as yet. Plan was to get a set from C.C. parts depot. I plan a visit next week and get my first installment of parts.

but i know nothing of the manufacturer quality of these bearings? Anyone know the origin/manufacturer of C.C’s replacement bearings. I can always ask them.

i googled those bearing numbers out of interest. DS Sassen shows tapered-roller-bearings for the stub-axle. Are these modern equivelant to the old ball-bearing oem units?

i was hoping the installed bearings could be left alone, but there are some very minor pitting/corrosion that makes replacement a no-brainer. Plus when this deep into it, makes sense to change what consumable parts can be.

good point about the bead of weld to contract the race. I remove valve-seats exactly this way.
Interesting ‘matey’ just smacks the races out/in. I’m not a fan of this at all, especially for new parts going in. i reckon the race in the freezer for a day and heat up the arm around the race-area and it’ll drop in with minimal persuasion?

And cutting the stub-axle inner-race off too. Surely the workshop has a puller? Whatever.

So, going forward plan is to drill out that tang on the OS-arm to undo that nut.
Remove the NS-arm and strip that whilst concluding best way forward with bearings.
I’ll do some searching, see what I can find stocked and available if a bteer optin than C.C. bearings?
Make a tool for those 6×9 bolts, i did see a socket for them on franzose site, but i can make somehting in an hour or so, save waiting for the tool.

Lots to be getting on with.

[Julian Klepacki]

The hub was stiff to rotate and felt ‘lumpy’. Suspectingn bearings, on removing stub axle, the internal grease was more like treacle and not that much of it. It had all dried out. I don’t think anyone has been inside the arms since build? The nut securing the stub-axle looked unmolested; tab-washer and paint-marking.

I was hoping bearing replacement was a straight forward affair; out with the old, in with the new. But, reading through D423.1 – Rear Wheel Stub Axle, it outlines the procedure to measure/obtain zero bearing clearance. identifying the shim thickness coupled with the length of the conical-spacer.

Fancy tool 2021-T looks to allows you to work it out without assembly. I don’t have that luxury.
But looking at dwg, it doesn’t look that big a deal to assemble it and measure?

This is based on the inner-race of the small bearing NOT being a super tight press-fit, to allow easy removal as required? When I removed the stub-axle, this inner-race was not tight. Stub-axle pushed out easily, it’s like a snug/slip fit on the shaft? For what it’s worth mine doesn’t have the shim. Just conical-spacer.

Any advice on setting up wheel bearing(s), man in the shed, diy stylee appreciated.
Any ‘homebreww’ tooling to aid setting it up etc?

I think I need to invest in bearing-pullers? I only have ‘legged’ pullers and to remove the small outer-race off the stub-axle, I take it i need a split-puller, like example below?

Also any tips/triks, DIY tool to remove the larger outer-race from the arm?
It looks like it needs a big blind-puller, approx 65mm diameter, to get under the lip of the race?

Tomorrow i’ll make a tool to remove those funny bolts. I’ve managed to loosen them, but my small 6mm spanner just slips off. I think I’ll replace them with cap-heads?

Also the Arm-mounting is very stiff to rotate, i suspect dried out treacle grease in that too. It was easy to rotate them on the car, with leverage of the arm. But trying to rotate the outer by hand is not easy. I suspect it should rotate freely.

I haven’t given it a go yet, need to secure the arm before tackling that nut. Looking at the securing nut, is that a ‘tab’ pressed in to secure the nut or some kind of alignment-aid with the slot on the shaft? if it is a tab, it’s substantial and doesn’t seem to want to bend back out easily?

TIA.

[Julian Klepacki]

Sorted.
Wedge idea worked a treat. it didn’t actually take much to get it moving.
I just didn’t want to start smacking it out of ignorance.

[Julian Klepacki]

OK, i see.
thats a good idea with the wedge. kinda ‘pressing’ it out.
failing that, lump of wood and big hammer.
TIA.

[Julian Klepacki]

Right, I’ve come to a standill on these rear arms.

Sphere’s removed in prep for removing cylinders. They came undone easily. I did start the car and pressurised it, but I think i was pi**ing in the wind, as the rear is on stands and wheels off, so didn’t/wouldn’t pressurise the rear? I carefully loosened the sphere monitoring teh cylinder incase it started to turn, but the sphere just came loose. Disconnected rod from arm and pushed it into cylinder out the way of the arms.

Now the rear-arms: I have slackened off the x3 nuts holding the arm on the inner wing.
I have removed the torsion-bar clamps and slackenned off the large castle-ated threaded ring in the boot.
Foolishly I thought it would come out as a whole assembly, but it seems stuck fast?

i expect it to be snug/tight and not come out easily, but short of braying it out, it’s stuck fast?
i can see removing the 38mm nut off the inner-arm in the boot, might remove the arm that way. But if bearings are pressed on etc, it won’t be so easy. Plus i’d like the whole assembly out complete?

What is the deal with the arm coming out?
TIA.

[Julian Klepacki]

mmm, that does seem a bit silly to part of the hub and not a replaceable race.
i’ll leave the front for now. i’m working from the rear and my wallets already startingn to sweat at the cost of the list being generated so far.

[Julian Klepacki]

Colin, I took it that the triangular/arrow-head bracket held the cylinder in position and prevents it turning in it’s mounting-housing. I take it it’s a snug fit in that inner-winng-housing.

Peter, inner-race of the ‘hub’ shown, is that actually the inner-race of the rear-arm?
are those a removable race or a bearing-surface machined & hardened as part of the arm?

hoping to get the arms off this coming week. I’ve been busy with peripherals of the rear end; closing panels, bumper-irons, wing-brackets and what not. cleaned, treated, small welding repair on a bumper-iron and ready for some epoxy primer tomorrow. Then top coats.

[Julian Klepacki]

Brilliant Colin, perfect.

I read on the Aussie forum, that to remove rear spheres, crack-loose under pressure first. Then de-press’ and remove? Failing to do this can damage high-press line? Is this correct?
I’m failing to understand if not under pressure how anyhting can get damaged relieving pressure, when there isn’t any to relieve?

Anyway, rear is on stands now, wheels off. But i can run it to pressurise if it is required.
But looking at your write up, conclude assemblies removed de-pressurised?

I’ll make a start today, soaking fasteners and at least crack-loose what i can.
TIA.

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